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celticfaith
Vice Captain

PostPosted: Tue Dec 28, 2010 8:57 pm


*~* DISCLAIMER!! The guild is not responsible for any outcomes of this topic. If a person's choices are illegal we are not held accountable, because it was their choice. We will neither condone or disapprove of your choices for each person has a unique home situation. We ask that you adhere to Gaiaonline Rules and Regulations *~*

I want to talk about something considered dark, and depressing, and for all rights it is.


Death.
It is something we all will have to face. Maybe you have faced it and triumphed for the time, maybe you know someone who has faced him and sadly did not triumph. I have recently had an experience that has opened my eyes and now I have to think about it.

It brings fear to those who hear his name. He is depicted as an evil man dressed in black; as a skeleton and scythe; as some horrible thing. But I ask you. What do you think of when you hear Death? Who do you see? Do you see Hecate, Danu, the Three Fates? What do you see?


Every single person has a belief about the afterlife. Some people believe what their religious leaders tell them to, some believe only part, and others believe what they want. What do you think? Is there an afterlife? When we feel Deaths sweet embrace, where will we go? Who will we meet? Will our loved ones, who might follow a different path, meet us there?

(This question is personal, and I am just curious)
What about a funeral? What do you want as yours? Do you think its wrong for pagans to be cremated? What about embalming? What about organ donation? What services would you want in your funeral? How would you want it?

And now I want to ask.
Why do you think this (As in the afterlife)?
Do you ever doubt this?
Do you ever think you are wrong and they are wrong, is anyone wrong?
Why do you think this?
What are your views of Suicide?
Do you think it is against the faith?
What do you think are the consequences of suicide?

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* I know these questions are hard, and some people will ask, hell I am (throwing an age out there) 18, why should I think about this? I'll tell you why. We must think about them. Life is short, tragically short. One day we are fine and the next things change.. Hell things change in a second.

I will hold my thoughts until later, I still need time to process my own thoughts, as I have said things have recently come to life
PostPosted: Thu Dec 30, 2010 10:31 pm


Excellent topic Celtic.

((Warning, long post is REALLY long. lol))

Personally I've always felt that when we examine our beliefs on death, we are actually also examining our beliefs on life. What ones believes happens after we die is very much influenced on what we believe we are indeed living for methinks.

It is my belief that we are living simple to well, live. To experience everything in the universe that can be experienced. All of it; joy and pain, bliss and suffering, sadness, love, emptiness, rage, patience, chaos, innocence, cruelty, insanity, brilliance, void, stagnation, pride, loyalty, dishonesty and everything in between. Naturally, for one soul to accomplish this, I feel this is where reincarnation comes into play as this task I would not think could be accomplished completely in a single physical lifetime, especially that of a single human life.

I know there are some traditions that feel say being reincarnated into a bug for example, might be seen as a punishment. I have to disagree. Perhaps the life of a bug might offer a perspective on life or life lesson that a human or any other creature could not possible comprehend. For example, what it is to be completely lacking any sense of morality. Bugs do not trouble themselves if eating other bugs is a morally acceptable thing to do. They do it to survive. Perhaps the 'purpose' or reason one might be reincarnated into such an 'insignificant' creature, is to experience simply living to be living, to survive and mate and those alone. Not a punishment, just a necessity, and a natural occurrence which is part of all that can be experienced.

And what of when the soul does accomplish this incredibly time consuming task of experiencing everything there is to experience? Why it starts all over of course! Although, of course, this is all just my own personal opinions here.

In response to the question of what do I see when I picture death, well honestly, no one in particular like a Deity or what not. I just mostly just think of the soul when I hear death. Although I feel I still have much to do in this lifetime, I'm honestly not afraid of death. Now, dying in a terrible manner would strike fear in anyone I think, but actually death itself, does not scare me. I see it just as another part of life and continuing cycles within unimaginably large cycles.

Now onto..
Quote:

What do you think? Is there an afterlife? When we feel Deaths sweet embrace, where will we go? Who will we meet? Will our loved ones, who might follow a different path, meet us there?


Well, as I mentioned I do believe in reincarnation but I suppose I can go just a little more into depth on my personal beliefs of the actual process. When a person passes, I don't think it automatically transfers over into another physical form. It can, but it doesn't have too. It could just roam around as free lance energy. Also, it may or may not have any recollection of a previous physical life it was attached to. While in the form of a human or even some animals, it may be able to recall things from a previous life, and then again it may not. I think if it is able to, this is for it's benefit in that current life but I don't feel someone who is incapable of recalling any such memories would automatically be at a disadvantage, perhaps it is just not necessarily or would apply/be helpful in that life. Then again perhaps a soul might be for some reason holding on to it's previous physical life a.k.a. ghosts.

As far as whether or not we will be able to re-connect with those passed before us when we die, well this is where you might have to bear with me lol. I fully believe in parallel universes and that time is non-linear. I won't go into this too much as it's rather hard to put into words exactly, but to the point, I think everything that ever has happened, is happening currently, or is ever to happen, is all occurring simultaneously. Because of this, I feel it is possible to 'connect' with any other soul at any given time. Even say our own in a future or past point in time. So essentially yes, one could re-connect with a soul passed once passed themselves, but I think this could be achieved at anytime if said soul permits it of course. I know. I'm odd.

Alrighty lets see what else you asked here...

Quote:
What about a funeral? What do you want as yours? Do you think its wrong for pagans to be cremated? What about embalming? What about organ donation? What services would you want in your funeral? How would you want it?


As for myself, I want a small funeral so that those I care for would be comfortable performing whatever rites I've asked, and whatever rites they personally wish to do to bring comfort to themselves. I want to be cremated. I've always felt that when you burn something it's a very strong symbol of release. Although, just out of curiosity, might I ask why you are curious if one might feel it wrong for a pagan to be cremated?

When it comes to organ donation, it may sound selfish but I do not want to donate mine. The reason being is that honestly I do not want to be physically connected to another person once I've died. Just a personal little quark of mine I suppose.

And for the last bits,

Quote:
Why do you think this (As in the afterlife)?
Do you ever doubt this?


Well it's mostly all a combination of what I've heard others theorize and lots and lots... and lots of personal thought. I don't doubt this to be my own self truths, but needless to say, I cannot claim that I am absolutely right. If I am wrong, I will have lived my life making sense of my own thoughts and having been comforted by them.

Quote:
Do you ever think you are wrong and they are wrong, is anyone wrong?
Why do you think this?


Everyone has as much probability of being wrong as everyone else methinks, as no one could be 0 percent knowledgeable of such things to a complete extent.

Quote:
What are your views of Suicide?
Do you think it is against the faith?
What do you think are the consequences of suicide?


I would say it would very much depend on what ones faith was. If they are any branch of Christianity then obviously it would go against their faith. If one was Wiccan, it would be against their faith. Although personally, as traumatic as it may be for those who are left to mourn in their absence, I think in the long scheme of things there is no major consequence of suicide for the individual soul committing it. It may vastly set the soul back from achieving the experiences it could have gained if it would have not ended that physical life so abruptly, but I just honestly don't believe one would be 'punished' for it.

Not even in the very next life. Which leads to something I thought I'd bring up. I know some of you may be asking, "But Matron, I've heard you mention Karma before, where does it come into play in all of this?"

Well, I believe that Karma, when used in the sense of 'action and reaction' only applies to a single life form/cycle. It is more a tool that is brought about and applied during one life and although present in every cycle, it does not overlap in a form of punishment nor reward. It simply adds to the entire process.

WOW. That was long lol. If you actually read all of that, your a trooper! lol

Matron_ofthe_Herd
Vice Captain


Lady Yume
Crew

PostPosted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 11:42 am


For myself, personally I don't find this subject dark/depressing or of any reflection of age. Death enters many lives usually through our loss of family members and good friends... and I say our loss instead of theres for in my beliefs we loose them in the life we are currently in but they do not usually loose themselves, they simply take a new form.
I've learned through experience and practice while working with the deceased, that you can only contact those that loose their way after a year from the leave of their bodies.
I have to very say, I'm in similarity with Matron in feeling that the discussion of death of our physical bodies is in accord with the life and following lives of our essence... however my beliefs differ slightly.
While I do beleive that each life is meant to be lessons learned, obsticles met and that ever life is meant to teach or re-attempt to teach all that we've yet to learn/accomplish for us to become whole and ascend. I also beleive that we our selves, our essence/spirit/soul is not whole that we seek in our lives seek out other aspects of our selves, that some we reject because they are the parts of our selves that we delike and must some day come to terms, rectify and except in order to find wholeness, and the ones we love the most, our "soul mates" maybe a peice of our self that helps to complete us... that we if have learned how will keep with us and find a closer wholeness of ourselves.
When it comes to the thought of death the images that come to mind are of Morrigan, Freya, and ArchAngel Gabriel: Death, renewal, rebirth.
As for funerals, cremation was once in a sense tradition with a funeral pyre. However, I feel personally that it doesn't matter. I would rather not be barried in the ground to someday possibly spread disease nor cremated and polute the air... so personally I feel that being a donor if possible now that this has been brought to mind would likely be best... and whatevers left feed to to something that eats meet. Then at least my body could give back to the earth in a more natural form. I simply would want people to celebrate their own lives and not fear what lies ahead, not discuss death but the continuam of life...

A favorite quote/poem is from The Book of Runes By Ralph H. Blum is:
Runes of Comfort for the Bereaved

I am the Life and the Light and the Way.
The Earth is my Garden.
Each of the souls I plant as seeds
Germinate and flowers in it's season
And in each I am fullfilled.
There is no cause for grief
When a blossom fades
But only rejoicing for the beauty it held
And praise that my will is done
And my plan served.
I am one with all creatures
And none is ever lost
But only restored to me
Having never left me at all.
For what is Eternal
Cannot be seperated from it's Source.
I am with you all,
And each of you is a channel for my Light.
Feel my Love
Enfold you now and evermore.


These beliefs have been formed from studies, life experiences, etc and the conclusions I've formed with them thus far. There are always times of doubt in many things throughtout our humanity but no, this has never been the case in these beliefs, though my beliefs have changed/expanded I've never once doubted them. And I don't nessessarily beleive that anyone is truely wrong, I beleive that not everyone is able to see the whole picture however... for in almost every belief there is some form of fact/truth... this I've learned through my research.
Suicide I feel is a very touchy subject, and while I don't believe it holds any sway on "fate" it is an inability to cope and I do strongly believe that those who do take this attempt to escape will continuously meet the same obsticle in lives to come until they successfully finally overcome them and can then continue on their souls journy of learning, tuning and refining til wholeness is found and 'assention' is permitted.
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Matured Mysticism

 
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