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 Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 12:26 pm
Alright, so I have a question for the masses here in our lovely guild. In your PERSONAL opinion's I would like to know what you all have to say about smoking. Some people have said it is " Un-Pagan" or "Un-Wiccan" to be a smoker when you believe in Wicca and or Paganism. Now with this question keep an open mind to what the religion/s are about as well as adding in your person opinion. If you're not a smoker and never plan to be that is fine, but do not let yourself make a judgment just on that basis. And PLEASE do not just post things like " smoking is bad ". I would like reasons behind your opinions. ~ Blessings Marii McKane
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Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 2:55 pm
Marii McKane Alright, so I have a question for the masses here in our lovely guild. In your PERSONAL opinion's I would like to know what you all have to say about smoking. Some people have said it is " Un-Pagan" or "Un-Wiccan" to be a smoker when you believe in Wicca and or Paganism. Now with this question keep an open mind to what the religion/s are about as well as adding in your person opinion. If you're not a smoker and never plan to be that is fine, but do not let yourself make a judgment just on that basis. And PLEASE do not just post things like " smoking is bad ". I would like reasons behind your opinions. ~ Blessings Marii McKane I really think it doesn't matter.Me personally I never plan on smoking, but I dont think it is bad, but I do think it is harmful, but so is everything a person does.I can see why people might say it is "un-pagan" or "un-wiccan", but I dont agree with them..I think it is a person choice, because our way sare not set in stone , sot-of-speek, we don't know all there is to on that area, so I don't think it is, but again it is everyones OPINION in that area..I think I have answered your question..If i didn't please ask me to redo it. Peace and Blessings Leo
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Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 10:49 pm
In my personal opinion, smoking tobacco or smoking pot can go either way on the Wiccan-morality spectrum. I say this because, historically and culturally, these plants have been ceremonially used in earth-based religions. On the other hand, however, both of these stimulants damage your body, and if we are to relate to the Litany of the Goddess, then our bodies are, quite literally, our temples and Hers as well. Therefore, defacing our bodies with any unhealthy act could be deemed as "un-Wiccan". Many Neo-pagans share similar beliefs in regard to hallucinagens that were once used in rituals and are now used for recreation, such as LSD, PCP or cocaine. The debate is heated; there are Wiccan groups that praise these drugs as bringing you closer to the divine, while still other groups claim that chemicals interfere with your being able to connect with the God and Goddess.
I suppose it comes down to personal choice. But for me, I've seen what cigarettes and other stimulants can do to a body, and I sure as hell don't want that sort of thing to happen to my body. When it comes right down to it, this vessel is the only one you're going to get in this lifetime, a gift from the Creator herself; so why abuse it?
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Posted: Fri Jun 15, 2007 1:45 am
I am really glad to see people are giving such good explinations. I like that those who have responded have put thought into it before just jumping to how they look at it. I am proud that so far those who have responded have looked at it both from a large view point as well as adding in their own thoughts on it.
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Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2007 8:16 am
For those who follow the Rede, smoking is most certainly not up to par with what one claims to be following for one's religious path. Not harming includes self-harm and there is little debate on smoking causing self-harm and is practically the equivalent of slow suicide. It also causes other-harm in the form of second hand smoke.
If you don't follow the Rede, though, it's up to you.
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Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2007 2:21 pm
Well here is a major thing that I notice most of us tend to forget. Wiccan's not Pagan's are restricted to the creed/rede. As far as most 'ancent' pagan cultures, they wouldnt have thought they were harming themselfs in smoking herbs and tobacco like products and as far as every day smokers of this time it is all a personal choice. On one hand you have people who say smoking causes cancer. While I can't say it does not aid in the development of cancerus cells, I personally do not agree that it 'Causes' cancer. I feel that if you're going to get cancer you're going to get it despite having ever smoked a cigarette. On the other hand it does cause other helth problems that could be just as harmful. It take's a toll on your lungs as well as many other parts. I feel it is personal choice in the end so don't get me wrong but it really does break down to how smokers interact with non smokers. It is simply polite to move away from non smokers if you want to smoke, but i disagree with people telling me I can not smoke in my car or walking down the street as long as it isnt directly next to people. Like where I live, there are a few citys near by here that have made it illegal to smoke in your car much less anywhere else in that city. I personally don't think that is right, I feel in being told that I can not smoke a legal substance even in the comfort of my own car that my rights as an american are being pulled quite thin.
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Posted: Wed Jun 20, 2007 5:30 pm
I agree.Here in Indiana it is illeage to smoke on public property, and in a resturant..but the car ban hasn't been inforced ..yet.. i agree with you on the its a direct violation of a humans rights.If someone is happy smoking , then they are taking away a right that all people are born with. " Life, Liberty, and the Pursut of Happiness" sweatdrop ....lol....But yah i agree with you Marii
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Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2007 11:38 am
Honestly, I think it's up to the person, i dont see anything unhealthy about it, the only unhealthy thing i see is most people who decide to smoke sit around, doing nothing, not getting active, and la de da, so the health problems i beleive, is not from the herb, not from the smoke, but from the person themselves...
There for i'm saying, if you do decide to smoke, or anything, it's up to you, try not to turn lazy and sit around and stuff, and make sure you keep you're health up...I mean I'm NOT a health critic, because i know i'm not healthy and stuff, but hey, I dont smoke, and I dont plan to because i'm allergic to cigerette smoke...so...yeh. anywho
Blessed Be,
Rhea Pendragon
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Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2007 9:51 pm
Avalon Niamh Sky Honestly, I think it's up to the person, i dont see anything unhealthy about it, the only unhealthy thing i see is most people who decide to smoke sit around, doing nothing, not getting active, and la de da, so the health problems i beleive, is not from the herb, not from the smoke, but from the person themselves... There for i'm saying, if you do decide to smoke, or anything, it's up to you, try not to turn lazy and sit around and stuff, and make sure you keep you're health up...I mean I'm NOT a health critic, because i know i'm not healthy and stuff, but hey, I dont smoke, and I dont plan to because i'm allergic to cigerette smoke...so...yeh. anywho Blessed Be, Rhea Pendragon But you're misinformed. It has been a great triumph of the tobacco industry to fool the public into believing that their product isn't toxic, but it is. Now, I'd abide by an arguement defending pure tobacco leaf products or non-additive marijuana, but chemicals are added to commercially sold cigarettes that make them poisonous. That is a fact, no longer debated by the scientific and political spheres, hence the newly established laws that ban smoking in public places. Quote: On one hand you have people who say smoking causes cancer. While I can't say it does not aid in the development of cancerus cells, I personally do not agree that it 'Causes' cancer. I feel that if you're going to get cancer you're going to get it despite having ever smoked a cigarette. And here, I must disagree on personal principle. I refuse to believe that my grandfather or my stepfather were going to die of cancer regardless of their smoking habits. Statements like that are convienient for people who want to justify their self destructive habits, but they are, in totality, completely unjustified. On the contrary, every study that has been been conducted by a repudable scientific group has proven that the chemicals in cigarettes DO cause cancer. Denying that is like trying to convince the masses that cocaine isn't addictive or nuerologically damaging. None of the above has anything to do with the original question; it is still, of course, the individual's choice to smoke or use. But any person grappling with that decision and seeking advice in this thread should not be mislead by statements touting the benign nature of the item in question. And to all, I humbly suggest that if doubt should plague your mind, you might embark on some research of your own.
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Posted: Sun Jun 24, 2007 12:46 pm
First and formost I asked for both the personal opinion as well as they full prospective. I posted my personal opinion. I never said it was good for you and I also never said it cant cause cancer, I said in my OPINION I feel that if you are going to get cancer then you are going to get cancer. Do not assume I have never had people in my life die of cancer or that I have no sympathy for how you feel. Cancer isnt like AIDS, you don't have to get it from something, sometimes it is just there. I am honestly offended by your statment. You have no idea what type of research I have done on my own, and I NEVER said that smoking isnt unhealthy or that it doesnt have its risks. As a smoker I feel no need to deffend it, because I am fully aware of the long term effects that it will have on my body. I had a family memeber die last year, he smoked sense he was in his early teens and died in his sixtys. He smoked, he drank every day, he chewed tobacco, he got cancer. His doctors told him flat out that his smoking had NOTHING to do with his having cancer. It also is not what killed him, the nemonia (sp?) he caught IN THE HOSPITAL is what killed him. Do not ever assume I do not know what I am talking about, I have done my fair share of reading and in that I have developed my own opinion, which you do not have to agree with, but it is my own and I did share it.
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Posted: Sun Jun 24, 2007 3:04 pm
Marii McKane First and formost I asked for both the personal opinion as well as they full prospective. I posted my personal opinion. I never said it was good for you and I also never said it cant cause cancer, I said in my OPINION I feel that if you are going to get cancer then you are going to get cancer. Do not assume I have never had people in my life die of cancer or that I have no sympathy for how you feel. Cancer isnt like AIDS, you don't have to get it from something, sometimes it is just there. I am honestly offended by your statment. You have no idea what type of research I have done on my own, and I NEVER said that smoking isnt unhealthy or that it doesnt have its risks. As a smoker I feel no need to deffend it, because I am fully aware of the long term effects that it will have on my body. I had a family memeber die last year, he smoked sense he was in his early teens and died in his sixtys. He smoked, he drank every day, he chewed tobacco, he got cancer. His doctors told him flat out that his smoking had NOTHING to do with his having cancer. It also is not what killed him, the nemonia (sp?) he caught IN THE HOSPITAL is what killed him. Do not ever assume I do not know what I am talking about, I have done my fair share of reading and in that I have developed my own opinion, which you do not have to agree with, but it is my own and I did share it. It is unfortunate that you were offended, as that was certainly not my intent to offend anyone. Certainly, we both expressed our own opinions, which though they are opposite, can both be of value to an external party seeking advice. Additionally, I would love to read the diatribe in which I accused you of not knowing what you were talking about. I did state that I diagreed with you on principle, and I certainly invited other parties to investigate for their own benefit should they doubt the facts that I was presenting, but never in my statement did I attack the knowledge which you set forth. I only expressed that my opinion, based own my experiences and research, is opposing to yours. And what good is a forum if only one opinion or view is expressed?
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Posted: Sun Jun 24, 2007 4:10 pm
You're right, you did not accuse me of not knowing what I was talking about and I admit that I may not have thought myself through before responding. I myself feel the need to tell you that I am sorry for that, you said nothing to imply I didnt know what I was talking about, so I am sorry. You're also right in saying that it does not make a good topic if people can not express their differing opinions, which we are doing and I should not have taken your statement so personally as you make valid points in what you say. ~ Marii
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Posted: Tue Jun 26, 2007 11:55 pm
Marii McKane You're right, you did not accuse me of not knowing what I was talking about and I admit that I may not have thought myself through before responding. I myself feel the need to tell you that I am sorry for that, you said nothing to imply I didnt know what I was talking about, so I am sorry. You're also right in saying that it does not make a good topic if people can not express their differing opinions, which we are doing and I should not have taken your statement so personally as you make valid points in what you say. ~ Marii
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Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 11:22 pm
Hm. I think smoking is a choice of the individual. It is harmful to your health and the health of others. Of course different types are more harmful than others. Marijuana (though i've never tried) typically isn't harmful, other than the smoke. But it is all natural after that. Cigarettes have harmful substences within them, nicotine which is addictive. CO2, tar.. and right now i'm too tired to look up anymore.. Let me just say, if you're smoking - don't stand by me. I have to shorten my breath to not breath it in large doses. And if you smoke near me on purpose, I WILL cough in your face. With no remorse.
Ohh so smoking isn't bad for your health? How about people who develop asthma from second hand smoke? Enough irritation to an organ (such as the lungs, or liver if you drink too much) will indefinately cause problems. Ask any doctor. The moment one stops smoking after years of doing it? Their skin tone brightens, they breath better, are more active, and over all more healthy.
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Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2007 1:53 pm
i think it matters in the way it is done
native americans smoke to acheieve higher plans and such
you know the whole peace pipe thing
but i think that uber smokoing that has the extra things happening inside it is relatively killing yourself slowly
andthe killing of anything is relatively frowned on
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